I’ve been around here and on former RTS-Forum for quite a while now and I think we should talk about something:
Requests for “old” or “vanished” Scripts!
At the moment, we don’t share Funscripts here freely. That’s completely ok, as the scripters have put love and work in it. And it is also the engine, that runs this platform: that we honor the scripters’ work.
It is NOT my Intention to change enything about this!
But there is also a reocurring topic with questions about Scripts that have been existing month or years ago…on RTS, Syncarmy or wherever. I had also some discussions about this topic with scripters like @Realcumber in the past. Or with others.
An argument, that i heared more often is something like: The fiunscript is product of the scripter and if he/she decides to withdraw it from the net, it is his right.
So now, THIS is the part where my bullshit-bell is ringing (Sorry, not meant accusing).
Nobody else in the world has the possibility to withdraw a once posted thing from the net and can expect, that it will be deleted forever
IF the script is in the world, and IF there are people still keeping it, THAN it is quite hypocritical to put Scripters’ intelectuall ownership over the possibility of sharing an existing script that is no longer available anywhere known.
At least as long as we not ban links to free video sources for commercial/paywalled stuff. Why worship scripters more than porn-industry?
So…let the shitstrom begin
EDIT: Of course, there still should then be a rule to NEVER share a script here, that can be purchased somewhere!
No shitstorm needed. There are laws around copyright and it doesn’t matter what your/our personal arguments and opinions are. Laws are laws. Just because you can’t find a copyright holder you aren’t legally allowed to start making copies.
I’m writing this as the creator of, so far, 24 scripts (I was actually a bit surprised that there are already over 20, it felt less ).
We are all aware that something that you put on the internet can/will never disappear again. This is not only the case with Funscripts, but with everything that is posted on the Internet. For example, I created mods for various games for a while (Microsoft Flightsim, Xplane11, Skyrim, …) and ALWAYS had to find out that my mods were taken and uploaded again elsewhere. Mostly without giving me even a little credit for the work that was “stolen” from me. At first I was really upset, but in the meantime I’ve (unfortunately) had to accept it.
In this respect, I find the Funscript community to be a very nice and sensible community. If Scripts are edited, improved or uploaded elsewhere, or even linked (looking at Scriptaxis), the original Creator is always named (as far as I have been able to determine this so far). Maybe it’s something in the nature of things, after all, this is about porn.
If a script disappears for whatever reason, it is to be expected that it will reappear somewhere sooner or later. We can’t prevent that and in my opinion there is no point in getting excited about it.
Yes, there are laws. But the internet is already a “lawless” area in so many places that, in my opinion, there is not much point in getting upset about a script that has been put on the Internet VOLUNTARILY and FREE of charge.
As long as the Creator is named, I have absolutely no problem with my Scripts being passed on. If this is done without naming the creator, it is annoying and certainly also extremely disrespectful, but we are still talking about the Internet here. The place where everyone is, has, can, may, does everything.
But in a time of “cancel culture” you have to be upset about everything and everyone. I am SOOOOO happy that we have no other Problems!
Now go on and hate me, for what i said. It´s only my opinion.
Just as i said: Why worship scripters more than the industry that provides the stuff that is scripted ? If you argue with copyright, we have also to ban every free link to stuff that is normally paid for…
In case of “Abandoned” Scripts, there is - from a legal point of view- indeed only a VERY small propability, that we get in huddle with copyright…A copyright is a legal procedure. intelectual ownership isn’t copyright On the other hand, you can be sure that all of the freely linked paywall VR Vids on this side, there IS an existing copyright!
Hi there, in case of the myself called “abandoned scripts” there is often no creator nameable. There is just one guy that wishes to get a script that he knows is existing and he NOT knows where to get it. THATS my point.
I’ll put a little bit of weight in the discussion: I Was myself looking for a vanished script a year ago or so. Nobody knew where to get it and in the end, there was a guy sending me a PM that he would have it and send me a copy for 3$ (and HE was NOT the Creator). Do we want THIS to happen in the PM section of this platform - being contrary of the speech in the frontend ? People making money out of the creations of others ? I don’t think so…
Ah. OK. Then I understand the problem, but stick to my opinion that there is no point in getting upset about it. Anyone who puts something on the Internet should be aware that it is no longer in their own hands. It WILL reappear whether you like it or not. Joy for those who can get overly upset about it.
Well, thats what i meant. If you release your thougths on the NET, they will STAY there. And if you haven’t paid a lot of money to lawyers in advance (or if you paid a little money to bad lawyers), it doesnt’t belong to you anymore. that’s simply a fact
Spreading something and charging money for something that was NOT CREATED by yourself is just a dick move. Anyone who does something like that is an asshole. This is disrespectful and in my opinion should be prevented as far as possible. But getting overly excited about it doesn’t really help either. Assholes will be assholes forever, and getting upset about it is wasted lifetime. However, I am thinking of the German proverb: “Wo kein Kläger, da kein Richter”-“Where there is no plaintiff, there is no judge.”
Obviously it’s true that it’s not possible to ‘truly’ remove something from the internet - once it’s out, it’s out.
However, the place to re-share ‘dead’ scripts isn’t EroScripts. If there’s a script that you know is around somewhere, but has been removed from EroScripts, then you’re welcome to hunt around and try to find it elsewhere, to ask people directly, etc. At the end of the day, like anything else online - if it’s gone, it’s gone.
I think it’s important that EroScripts be a place where you can be confident that the person sharing the script has the right to do so, and that creators can be comfortable that their IP and work will be respected.
A simple rule is much easier to enforce and communicate, and in this case, the simple rule is “don’t post a script that you didn’t create”.
If the goal is to have a situation where any script that has been shared here can be re-shared if it goes away, then the only legal solution would be for the site to add a EULA stating that uploading scripts implicitly grants a perpetual license to anyone that downloads it, with limited distribution rights (e.g. you can repost it here, but must give credit to the original author).
That wouldn’t be outrageous - it’s basically what a number of services already do for pictures - but clearly not everyone would like that. In general, I would be in favor of something like that. If you upload the script to be freely available, it should remain freely available even if you delete or edit your post to remove it. Anything contrary to that violates the spirit of this site. If you want your scripts behind a paywall, keep them behind a paywall. If you want them to be freely available for a limited period of time, then handle that outside the site.
Failing that option, there are basically two things to consider. One is whether to allow posts requesting scripts that used to be accessible but no longer are. The second is whether responses should be allowed which attach the requested script, or whether the details should be left to private messages. In the latter case, someone who didn’t author the scripts but asks for money should be reported and, following a reasonable investigation, banned from the forums. That kind of thing just isn’t kosher.
When it comes to actually abandoned scripts (e.g. something posted to the now-dead RTS forums), I doubt there’s really much contention. The only really sticky situation would be someone who released a script publicly, then decided to start making money from scripting, and retroactively removed those scripts. Legally, the issue is pretty clear, but let’s face it - nobody is going to be sued over anything to do with this kind of scripting, unless it’s for collecting and selling scripts created by someone else as a commercial venture.
So what do you do? Are the scripts the same, but only moved from free public access to behind a paywall? Or have they been substantially improved before doing that? Perhaps the most sensible option is to simply allow people to request historical scripts that have become inaccessible, but also allow the verified author to nip those requests in the bud (publicly - policing private messages is never acceptable without one of the parties initiating action). There are some logistics there that would need figuring out, but I think it’s a better option than simply banning attempts to recover lost scripts that the original author has abandoned entirely.
Dont forget guys he is talking about abandoned scripts commercial available scripts aren’t abandoned so are not part of what he’s talking about.
Well if you talk about free scripts, there free so if you’d share the free ones i made i wouldnt have a problem with it. If you’d made a vault where all the free scripts are in so that they are not getting lost if a forum like this is gone. Go ahead you could add the scripts that i uploaded to the free category.
But for the commercial ones then its a different story. I do not know what i’d do with my commercial scripts if i decided to stop (abandon them). either i tried to sell them to another and he could do with them what he wants. Or i post them here and then they would be free. I would not keep them for myself (unless me stopping commercially is only for a limited time) as i made them for people to enjoy. And what good does it do to remove them forever.
I think the copyright laws need to be tweaked a little. And add something like if the owner of the rights wants to withdraw the product he must accept a reasonable bid of another to buy the rights of reselling or producing the copyrighted product if the benefit of the “population” outweighs the need of the owner.
This does not need to go for everything but it should at least count for medical products. As it is ridiculous that good working medicines are withdrawn from the market because the owner of the copyright (in this case the patent) thinks it is not profitable enough (this really happens, one case that i know of is a cancer medicine that was replaced by another that had much more dangerous side effects (heart failures by prolonged use) without any benefits compared to the original one,just because they could make more money with it, and they destroyed the better one ( a dutch researcher is now trying to re invent the original product). In cases like this the health of the population should outweigh that of the intellectual rights.
Just as i said: Why worship scripters more than the industry that provides the stuff that is scripted ? If you argue with copyright, we have also to ban every free link to stuff that is normally paid for…
In case of “Abandoned” Scripts, there is - from a legal point of view- indeed only a VERY small propability, that we get in huddle with copyright…A copyright is a legal procedure. intelectual ownership isn’t copyright On the other hand, you can be sure that all of the freely linked paywall VR Vids on this side, there IS an existing copyright!
I’m with this guy. It’s nice to be nice about protecting people’s work, but I really do think Eroscripts tends to make this more complicated than it needs to be.
If someone wants their work taken down so they can start selling it, that’s fine. If it’s just abandoned - why assume that everyone who put their work out there for free would want it taken down if they disappear? I’d want my free scripts shared around!
If I moved on and any scripts I released for free aren’t allowed to be shared? Well, that would absolutely suck if nobody is allowed to enjoy the result of all those hours I put in. All that work would’ve been for nothing. The assumption should be the other way around - continue to share in line with the author’s original intent, until we hear otherwise.
Show of hands - how many scripters out there have released scripts for free, only to want them removed from the internet for non commercial reasons (apart from putting out an improved version)? Not many I imagine. If someone does ask for that to happen, it’s their right - but it would be a true rarity.
Furthermore, as pointed out previously - I do find it rather strange to be hardline on this, when free links to videos that were definitely NOT released for free are shared with such reckless abandon here. Every counterpoint to not resharing scripts can also be applied to that (way more financially damaging) practice - so why is that OK?
Honestly, some time ago I stopped caring if someone reshares my scripts until he is not a dick about it. This is why I also put metadata in all my work so if it gets reshared at least there is a trace of where it origins. I know that it can be easily removed but most people will be too lazy for that.
Although in my opinion one link containing everthing that ever has been done is not neccessary, I think it would be fine if we had all scripts sorted in folders by the name of creators. In my opinion it’s better to share a link like this here rather then find about it on some torrent site sooner or later - at least people will be still interested in visiting eroscripts for more and we will have ability to manage it when needed. This also brings another problem: who will be responsible for managing a thing like this - there is no way everyone should be able to add to it, because we all know how it will end up. Of course the scripts should always be considered a property of the scripters and removed when asked for.
A few questions for everyone to ask themselves:
Is there really a need for everyone to download 2000 scripts or so at once? I can imagine the amount of confusion when people will try to find out if the script is for the video they are interested in. In comparision to RTS we have a decent tagging system here so people can filter out what they want.
What with the scripts that no longer have videos, because they got removed or are hard to access? Won’t it create even more piracy on the site because people won’t be able to find a video for the scripts? I’m a scripter for 1.5 year and some of the videos for my scripts already dissapeared. We all should do our best to protect the site from being a target for copyright laywers and this is why I will never agree with the decision to allow links for external sites containing pirated contents, however it’s not the part of the discussion.
Won’t a link / folder with all scripts make a process of topic creation pointless? There is already a problem with getting feedback for created scripts so why would people comment on scripts when they can just download everything without any effort. The only payment for free scripts is feedback and likes under post so I’m a little scared that it will result in less people creating scripts.
You can always report messages like this, it is something for the mods to deal with. I’ve got offered several times an “opportunity” to exchange accounts to vr sites and always refused / reported them. Whenever someone asks you for the money or account credentials you should be very concerned.
It is not about being concerned, i was talking about the development towards to such a behaviour by strictly claiming, that scripts are only property of an author and if they have been withdrawn from the net, than it is the aouthors right. NO ONE ELSE in the World with content in the internet has this form of luxury. So what I wanted to deal with is simply the way we deal with obviously abandoned stuff to prevent PM-sided moneyx making with content from others. To deal with it by reporting it to the mods doesn’t solve the problem that there are vanished scripts that are people looking for.
Just because someone can pickpocket someone else wallet and not be caught doesn’t make it legal.
Just because you can download something that someone else published on the internet without the copyright owners or intellectual property owners consent and not be caught doesn’t make it legal.
I’m fully aware that once something has been published on the Internet it’s impossible to take it down. However, just because that is a fact doesn’t automatically makes it ok to publish whatever you want. And just because something is made available on the Internet doesn’t void the copyright and intellectual property laws.
The best would be to add something in the EULA for this site that by publishing a script here you allow people to share it with others forever as long as the script is left unchanged and appropriate credit is given or something. If some scripters don’t like it then they can remove their scripts and publish their stuff elsewhere.
And how do you plan to confirm that those vanished scripts weren’t taken down by authors. I know for a fact that RTS was full of posts where scripts were deleted because of the author’s decision to try to get money out of their hard work or they were just upset by people who are always expecting more. Many people don’t even sort scripts they have by paid and free so if your idea is for everyone to start sharing what they have on drives this place will become piratebay for scripts.
I still think that the best way is to report it to the moderator team to get rid of the people like that or at least make their life harder.
On the other points I’m with @sentinel, there are laws and regulations for that sort of thing.
(Sorry, not meant accusing).